Do you think these were the original hostiles?!
That's all I really gathered by this scene.
They went way back in the past.

I thought it was the pre meeting the losties others. Because the 2004 Others learned the hard way not to mess with the losties.

I say, the hostiles.

i think it was the others...remember all their torches in the tom/jack scene....light em up

I wondered if the Black Rock was arriving at the island. The flaming arrows seem to be the correct technology for the time period that the Black Rock is from.

This was my immediate take on that whole scene:
Moments before, Miles says he's going to look for food. He comes right back with a fresh boar that just "happened" to die. Then Frogurt mocks Rose's husband for not being able to make fire. He is immediately hit with a flaming arrow. It's some kind of "ask and ye will receive" thing, only Frogurt got his in spades.

I would assume it was the soldiers, but they seemed to have guns. Maybe they were going for shock and awe, and trying to draw the losties to them.

Maybe they jumped to the distant past, when the Hostiles were still living in the Stone Age and boars were plentiful. Then, while running away from the Hostiles, they jumped ahead to around the 1960s, before Dharma arrived, when the Island was occupied by British soldiers.

It seems that one doesn't ever jump to a time when the island was uninhabited or when the inhabitants were friendly. But maybe there has never been such a period, just successive groups of newcomers being shot at by whoever survived from last time.

I want to say they are a civilization from long ago. We've never seen the Others with bows and arrows. The military men are seen carrying rifles so I don't want to say it's them except we didn't see a shift in time with any flashes of light. Hard to say either way.

I want to say they are a civilization from long ago. We've never seen the Others with bows and arrows. The military men are seen carrying rifles so I don't want to say it's them except we didn't see a shift in time with any flashes of light. Hard to say either way.


I thought they were Dharma

I want to say they are a civilization from long ago.
It's got to be something like that. The "four toed statue (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Four-toed_statue)" people come to mind. If it was DHARMA, or the Others, or the Hostiles, or Jones' soldiers (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Jones_%28The_Lie%29), or Rousseau's people (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Science_expedition), then they'd have come out with grenades and rifles. The only other possibility that springs to mind might also be the survivors (if any) of the Black Rock (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Black_Rock)... But even they would have had guns, probably.

Maybe they were the GREGs, the original group of conservative hostiles that couldn't peacefully coexist with the more free-spirited, idealistic DHARMA group.

Maybe they jumped to the distant past, when the Hostiles were still living in the Stone Age and boars were plentiful. Then, while running away from the Hostiles, they jumped ahead to around the 1960s, before Dharma arrived, when the Island was occupied by British soldiers.

It seems that one doesn't ever jump to a time when the island was uninhabited or when the inhabitants were friendly. But maybe there has never been such a period, just successive groups of newcomers being shot at by whoever survived from last time.
This made me smile. :)

There wouldn't be enough drama if the inhabitants were friendly. Jumping to when it was uninhabited would be interesting--The Island's life story.

Maybe they were the GREGs, the original group of conservative hostiles that couldn't peacefully coexist with the more free-spirited, idealistic DHARMA group.
This is the first time I've heard of the GREGs. I checked, and it isn't listed in the Lostpedia site. Why does it have that acronym? Could you please elaborate?

It seems odd that there are so many groups. Ignoring the Losties, we have so far had:
The Dharma Initiative, they died.
The Flaming arrow group
The British soldiers, calling it their island
The others who killed Dharma, are they the same flaming arrow group, before they got technology?
The black rock crew
The four toed statue builders

And I think that's all of them so far. Quite a list!

It seems odd that there are so many groups. Ignoring the Losties, we have so far had:
The Dharma Initiative, they died.
The Flaming arrow group
The British soldiers, calling it their island
The others who killed Dharma, are they the same flaming arrow group, before they got technology?
The black rock crew
The four toed statue builders

And I think that's all of them so far. Quite a list!
I still hold that the group firing the arrows, the british soldiers, and the others are one and the same. I think they went back to a time, way back judging by the fifties era uniforms, before the others encountered the losties. I also go by Richard's words to Locke, the next time I see you I'm not going to know you. As for the flaming arrows, it is standard operating procedure for the others to attack any new people to the island and pretend to be primitive.

If thats the case, and you say the British soldiers are the same group, why did they suddenly appear with guns? There was no time jump during them running through the jungle, so why the sudden decision to show you're not a primitive island inhabitant?

If thats the case, and you say the British soldiers are the same group, why did they suddenly appear with guns? There was no time jump during them running through the jungle, so why the sudden decision to show you're not a primitive island inhabitant?
Well, perhaps they genuinely believed they had killed everyone at the beach and weren't expecting to find anyone in the jungle. And perhaps it was before they had perfected the whole walk through the jungle barefoot and in rags routine.

Nah, doesn't make sense to me. I'm thinking its two different groups. Hell, perhaps they were soldiers hired by the Dharma Initiative, to wipe out the original inhabitants. Except they obviously failed, or didn't get them all.

I think there will be an episode in the future where the losties will fling firey arrows at someone or something on the beach ;)

I believe it was pre Dharma and was the original inhabitants of the Island. They were called hostiles by the Dharma group because of what they had encountered in the past with visitors to the Island, IE, the Soldiers. The soldiers saying it was their island doesn't surprise me since during WWII Islands were being captured and then taken and then recaptured. Or it could be the same as Cortez coming to Central America and trying to rule because of the treasure he heard of and the power.

TPTB have stated in the past that the Island had a long history. We are just getting a taste of it now.

I'm not sure if the flaming arrows and the guys who grab Sawyer and Juilette are the same. But my initial impression of those guys was that they were part of Danielle's team. Chopping off hands? Reminds me of Montand losing his friggin arm.

Just a theory, but it's possible they went back to the time of Danielle.
Another thought: Do you think they'll find Danielle and we'll get some more of her story?

I assumed the arrows where from Richard and the "hostiles" (the others were part of this, but some were recruited later) and the British soliders where just part of Dharma

It's a joke. It's because of the tv show "Dharma & Greg"!

It's a joke. It's because of the tv show "Dharma & Greg"!
What? How is a mediocre show related to unknown assailants firing flaming arrows?

This was my immediate take on that whole scene:
Moments before, Miles says he's going to look for food. He comes right back with a fresh boar that just "happened" to die. Then Frogurt mocks Rose's husband for not being able to make fire. He is immediately hit with a flaming arrow. It's some kind of "ask and ye will receive" thing, only Frogurt got his in spades.

Charlie got in spades in Season 1 when he was in the cave and yelled "I am a Rock God" and the ceiling fell in.

I believe it was Danielle and her people, and that they will run into them. I really hope they do!

This was my immediate take on that whole scene:
Moments before, Miles says he's going to look for food. He comes right back with a fresh boar that just "happened" to die. Then Frogurt mocks Rose's husband for not being able to make fire. He is immediately hit with a flaming arrow. It's some kind of "ask and ye will receive" thing, only Frogurt got his in spades.

My immediate thought about Miles finding the dead boar was that he just went into the jungle and listened for something dead. he seemed to know that he was going to find food, he was very confident. i think this was because he knew that he could go in there, and locate a dead animal for meat. he's the "ghost whisperer" remember? thats how he knew how long it had been dead for and whatnot.

here is a problem...
if flaming arrow people or 50s army people are also Danielle's people... wouldn't her daughter be 50? and she a lot older? Didn't she give birth to Alex on the island only to have her swiftly taken away by Ben?

anywho...i think flaming arrow people are fighting widmore's people and the traversing losties are stuck in the middle

This is the first time I've heard of the GREGs. I checked, and it isn't listed in the Lostpedia site. Why does it have that acronym? Could you please elaborate?

It's a joke. It's because of the tv show "Dharma & Greg"!

LOL, sorry about that Saukkomies - morpheus917 is right. It was just an obscure joke on my part, alluding to that old ABC sitcom.

What? How is a mediocre show related to unknown assailants firing flaming arrows?

Haha, whoops, I think morpheus917 neglecting to quote my post in their reply only confused matters more. His/her response was in regards to my post being a joke ... not the flaming arrow scene being a joke.... :rolleyes:

These are the Egyptian descended Hostiles

They have been on the island long before the Others, black rock origin.

They might even have their own "prophet" like Jacob to the others. Or take orders from Jacob himself.

I thought maybe they were Charles' Widmore's people, back when he (supposedly) was on the island...the English accents fit...the way they referred to it as 'our island' made me think of the scene where Ben confronts Widmore at the hotel, and Widmore says its his island, and that it always was...of course the Others referred to it as their island as well...

I like that theory Grandpa! Makes perfect sense.

Yes I agree, they are possibly Widmore's. They were wearing uniforms (looked a lot like the DI uniforms), so they might not be the Egyptian descended hostiles. But the guys who wanted to chop Juliet's hand off seemed so bellegerently hostile. I dont think they were Dharma.
:34853_huh:Could they be a totally different group? :34853_huh:

Huh. It never crossed my mind that it'd be Widmore's people. Makes obvious sense since Widmore is British, as were the soldiers. :D

I assumed the arrows where from Richard and the "hostiles" (the others were part of this, but some were recruited later) and the British soliders where just part of Dharma

That seems to make sense. You would think that the "hostiles" would not have guns. I do not remember, but I think the guys who captured Sawyer had guns. If these two events were from the same group of people, wouldn't they use the same weapon systems?

Personally I think it was a poor attack on the group in general. I would think you would use the flaming arrows to attack a structure of some sort. Use the fire to burn it down. You would not need fire to attack a single person. I think the arrow itself would do the damage. Also, wouldn't they surround them a little better to prevent their escape.

How many of the Losties are left? I thought most of them were killed off at the others compound when the freighter guys attacked?

I don't know if this was brought up but the soldiers who caught Sawyer and Juliet were wearing extremely similar uniforms to the Dharma people filming the orientation video in the first episode of this season.

I don't know if this was brought up but the soldiers who caught Sawyer and Juliet were wearing extremely similar uniforms to the Dharma people filming the orientation video in the first episode of this season.
No the people filming the Dharma orientation had the typical Dharma brown jumpsuits. The soldiers are pre-Dharma, pre-flight 815 Others.

No the people filming the Dharma orientation had the typical Dharma brown jumpsuits. The soldiers are pre-Dharma, pre-flight 815 Others.

I thought they were the same people when I was watching. That is the people filming the arrow orientation and the soldiers who captures Sawyer and Juilet.

No the people filming the Dharma orientation had the typical Dharma brown jumpsuits. The soldiers are pre-Dharma, pre-flight 815 Others.

Woland, I agree that they are pre-flight 815, but we don't have a comprehensive enough time line to know who may have co-existed with DI, do we? Do you have a view as to whether Widmore was involed with DI? I somehow think that Widmore is separate to DI. However, if Widmore was into "silly experiments" as Ben puts it, then maybe he was? My sense is that Widmore has a much longer connection with the Island, hence his wanting to buy the log of the Black Rock at auction - unless that was part of his looking for clues as to the whereabouts of the Island, and if so, how did he know the Black Rock and the Island are connected?

Huh. It never crossed my mind that it'd be Widmore's people. Makes obvious sense since Widmore is British, as were the soldiers. :D

Automission, as a Brit myself, I'm surprised that I didn't spot that. However Lost is fairly cosmopolitan, and so I don't think that it's consclusive that Widmore would only work with Brits - look at the freighter crew!

That seems to make sense. You would think that the "hostiles" would not have guns. I do not remember, but I think the guys who captured Sawyer had guns. If these two events were from the same group of people, wouldn't they use the same weapon systems?

Personally I think it was a poor attack on the group in general. I would think you would use the flaming arrows to attack a structure of some sort. Use the fire to burn it down. You would not need fire to attack a single person. I think the arrow itself would do the damage. Also, wouldn't they surround them a little better to prevent their escape.

How many of the Losties are left? I thought most of them were killed off at the others compound when the freighter guys attacked?

Pascalephoto, I'm with you on this point - separate groups!! I was also amazed at the huge number of people on the beach. I think that there had been at least two boat trips to the freighter, so that should have got 10 people off the Island, plus the Oceanic 6. Even accounting for Miles, Charlotte and Daniel, there seemed to be a lot of people around. Had to laugh about Neil's last words though "We can't even get fire!" - priceless..

Automission, as a Brit myself, I'm surprised that I didn't spot that. However Lost is fairly cosmopolitan, and so I don't think that it's consclusive that Widmore would only work with Brits - look at the freighter crew!



.
That's true about the freighter crew, but then again he hired them for their special skills, if he were to use an army to take the island, skills hardly factor into it. Any one would do.
And for the record, I too am a Brit. :)

Woland, I agree that they are pre-flight 815, but we don't have a comprehensive enough time line to know who may have co-existed with DI, do we? Do you have a view as to whether Widmore was involed with DI? I somehow think that Widmore is separate to DI. However, if Widmore was into "silly experiments" as Ben puts it, then maybe he was? My sense is that Widmore has a much longer connection with the Island, hence his wanting to buy the log of the Black Rock at auction - unless that was part of his looking for clues as to the whereabouts of the Island, and if so, how did he know the Black Rock and the Island are connected?

I still hold that they're pre-Dharma others, from the uniforms I'd say they're back in the fifties. I also think the young British soldier who threatened to cut Juliet's hand off is
young Widmore.
If it is him he would know about the Black Rock log, he saw the Black Rock wreck and heard the story of the black rock from his comrades.

My guess is the pre-815 Others. The whole 'surprise attack from out of sight' approach leads me to this theory. We have seen the Others 'attack from the shadows' several times before. Two big examples of this would be when they abducted Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley from the area around the Pearl station's pneumatic tube exit aperture in the S2 finale and when they attacked Keamy's team by the helicopter in the S4 finale.

No whispers?!

I thought they were Dharma

From the previews it looked like there were people were dressed in Dharma uniforms so maybe its possible that Dharma was firing the arrows at them because they thought they were the hostiles or vise versa.

It just occurred to me that maybe this isn't the first time the island has been moved. If that is true, it could be that there are other people skipping through time. These flaming arrows could be some earlier settlers way of dealing with all the unfreindly visitors to their island. Or, maybe it's just the "hostiles." Do we even know who the "hostiles" refers to? Richard's people aren't the "hostiles" are they?

The original Hostiles were firing the flaming arrows. Remember the orientation film Pierre Chang was making.....For the ARROW (as in Flaming Arrow) station ....to develop strategies against the Hostiles.....

It just occurred to me that maybe this isn't the first time the island has been moved. If that is true, it could be that there are other people skipping through time. These flaming arrows could be some earlier settlers way of dealing with all the unfreindly visitors to their island. Or, maybe it's just the "hostiles." Do we even know who the "hostiles" refers to? Richard's people aren't the "hostiles" are they?

Thats a good thought. :a015: I always considered Richard and his people as from the Black Rock, and that the DI thought they were the natives, so could that be a misconception and that there is another group the real natives.. who was firing the burning arrows.
I agree Richard and his people could have also been unstuck in time before "the incident" happened?

I wonder what would happen if Jack were to be shot by one of these arrows at the same time he makes a time jump.

To see what "might" happen think of this while you watch the first minute of the pilot as jack wakes up in the jungle, he definitely checks his chest twice for something that obviously isnt there

I think he checks out his chest to see if anything is sticking out because he had a gash on his back side. Remember Kate helped him stitch it up.

I think he checks out his chest to see if anything is sticking out because he had a gash on his back side. Remember Kate helped him stitch it up.

If I had a pain in my back, the first thing I would do is check my back not my chest. Also if you look at his knuckles they are bruised as if he had been in a bit of a scuffle with someone. When he wakes up he doesn't look shocked in the slightest, I am sure he was expecting to wake up there.

I wondered if the Black Rock was arriving at the island. The flaming arrows seem to be the correct technology for the time period that the Black Rock is from.

This.

we know who fired them, since ..

the preview pics show the same merc. soldiers with bows and arrows..AND the lost gods have said that a new group will be on the island this season

Where did the thread from last week on 'who are the soldiers' go? this one seems to have replaced it.

It just occurred to me that maybe this isn't the first time the island has been moved. If that is true, it could be that there are other people skipping through time. These flaming arrows could be some earlier settlers way of dealing with all the unfreindly visitors to their island. Or, maybe it's just the "hostiles." Do we even know who the "hostiles" refers to? Richard's people aren't the "hostiles" are they?


I think Richard's group are the hostile's because when he met Ben he was not a dharma scientist and it was Richard who helped Ben kill the dharma people and then Ben became their leader. I think the incident with the fire arrow was something that had already happened and the survivors got caught up in it even thou they are not the ones the arrows are supposed to fired at.