Is it possible to gas an island? How would this be effective?
Would you need an undergroud vent system? Or is this a clue to the snowglobe theory?
I just can't see how setting a killer gas off from one place on an island that size(still not sure what size exactly) would kill every living person.Also the polar bears didn't seem effected by the purge....unless they were in their cave but surely a gas which kills every living person on this island would penertrate a cave?

Without a vent system of some kind, I don't see how the entire island could be gassed from one station. Perhaps there is a vent system - but that's pretty elaborate!

Cerberus Vents?

Charlotte says '...wouldn't use the gas to kill every single person on this island'

The gas would be packed in containers and used from them. Listen to the latest podcast for more comments.

- There is no killer-gas-vent system for the whole island
- GAS is not short from Globe And Santa
- Kate needs a haircut
- CV in the hatch map means Cocoa Vault (of apollo bars)

Charlotte says '...wouldn't use the gas to kill every single person on this island'

The gas would be packed in containers and used from them. Listen to the latest podcast for more comments.

What was the countdown about when Daniel is typing all that stuff in?

If the gas was heavier than air, and you pumped out enough of it, you could probably do it. But it would take a long time.

I found it quite ironic that Ben was saying all along that the people coming to the Island from the Freighter were going to kill every living person on the Island....when it was actually Ben himself who had the capability of doing this all along by releasing The Tempest's gas!

I think of the gas as being sort of Ben's nuclear arsenal - it's a weapon of last resort.

My guess would be that if there are indeed the cerebrus vents, then there could and would most likely be other vents to execute this type of attack. Although I would agree that it would not be easy making something like this

What was the countdown about when Daniel is typing all that stuff in?

It was for the facility only. The alarm said "remove unnecessary personnel" - that didn't mean evacuate the whole island in one minute countdown.

Unless The Tempest is Smokies home/birthplace.............

Is it possible to gas an island? How would this be effective?
Would you need an undergroud vent system? Or is this a clue to the snowglobe theory?
I just can't see how setting a killer gas off from one place on an island that size(still not sure what size exactly) would kill every living person.Also the polar bears didn't seem effected by the purge....unless they were in their cave but surely a gas which kills every living person on this island would penertrate a cave?

The "purge" was clearly shown to be done with canisters of gas used at the dharma barracks, just like the one Benry used to kill his Dad. I don't know why people think the entire island was 'gassed' during it. It could be said they made the canisters at this station, but i doubt it.

I agree, it does not seem possible to gas the entire island from one location. they showed large storage tanks with (presumably) the gas in it. The Island per Danielle's map is about 20 long by 10 miles wide; so 200 sq. miles. Lots of places to find the map. Only way I think it could be done is to shoot a rocket up over the island and have it blow up, and rain down the gas, like how nuke explosions are done above their targets.

we don't see any indication of rockets...except...on the hatch mural, see------------------>

I was thinking they used the canisters, too, like Ben did when he murdered his father. Did we see any canisters at Otherville when Ben shows up and meets Richard?

If Ben wasn't working alone, perhaps other Dharma mutinees set canisters off while most of them were at lunch in a community type meal room. Somehow I see them all taking their meals together. Or maybe an alarm was sounded which prompted them all to go to one large room and that is where the canisters were set off. I know some were outside but maybe they stubbled out before dying?

Was Richard involved in the gasing? I wonder how many people were "natives" like him when Ben found him in the woods that one day. Who are original Other Natives, and who were New Others that showed up later, like Juliette?
I got to thinking about this because I was wondering how everyone could be gased at once on the Island. I dont think from the Tempest, had to be canisters. But how would Ben release that gas or even get it if he is captured by Locke? And wouldnt he want to make sure the Others (that like him) were in hiding so it wouldnt get to them?

It would only make sense to me that they used canisters in the purge as well. There is one thing in my opinion, that does not support that idea though. When Richard and Ben are back in the middle of the barracks with the bodies strewn about, Richard clearly checks his watch and then very slowly removes his gas mask. I always found him checking his watch to be very odd. It was is if there was a specific time frame in which the gas was effective or something. I dunno, could be nothing, but I found that strange.

I thought I'd do a bit of research about nerve gas. I'm not sure whether this information has already been posted elsewhere, and I'm not sure what kind of nerve gas that we saw in The Tempest was, but I thought this information might be informative, so here goes:

1. Here's an Associated Press article released and printed in numerous newspapers that discusses the Tooele, Utah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tooele_Army_Depot)nerve gas destruction program being carried out by the US Army. It describes how the experts have had to change their data on how deadly they believed Sarin nerve gas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarin) is. Here are some excerpts from this article:

Associated Press
September 3, 1998, Thursday, AM cycle for state and regional distribution
Nerve gas stored in Tooele twice as deadly as first believed
Dateline: Tooele, Utah

"A new study found that a nerve agent stored at the Tooele Army Depot is almost twice as deadly as previously believed....

"The Army had estimated that breathing 70 milligrams of Sarin per minute in a cubic meter of air would cause serious health problems. The new studies showed that 40 milligrams in a minute was enough to kill anyone, and the estimate could be lowered to 35 milligrams per minute."

End of quote.

Here's another story that took place in 1968 about an accidental nerve gas release in Utah, which killed a whole bunch of sheep. There was an attempt by the US Government to hush this up, but word got out and it created quite a scandal. This came to be known as the Dugway Sheep Incident (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dugway_sheep_incident). It appears that the cause of these sheep deaths was that the Army was spraying some VX nerve gas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VX_%28nerve_agent%29) from a jet airplane (sort of like a super fast crop-duster) - some TWENTY SEVEN MILES away from the place where the thousands of sheep were instantly killed!!! The cloud of gas descended on the location - known as Skull Valley (appropriately), and instantaneously killed thousands of sheep. Fortunately no humans were around, or they'd have been killed, too.

Here's a newspaper article (http://lists.jammed.com/IWAR/1998/01/0004.html) that talks about this incident in detail.

From these articles, I would say that it would be quite easily conceivable to imagine that a release of nerve gas on the Island would have the potential to kill every living person on the Island.

I thought I'd do a bit of research about nerve gas. I'm not sure whether this information has already been posted elsewhere, and I'm not sure what kind of nerve gas that we saw in The Tempest was, but I thought this information might be informative, so here goes:

1. Here's an Associated Press article released and printed in numerous newspapers that discusses the Tooele, Utah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tooele_Army_Depot)nerve gas destruction program being carried out by the US Army. It describes how the experts have had to change their data on how deadly they believed Sarin nerve gas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarin) is. Here are some excerpts from this article:

Associated Press
September 3, 1998, Thursday, AM cycle for state and regional distribution
Nerve gas stored in Tooele twice as deadly as first believed
Dateline: Tooele, Utah

"A new study found that a nerve agent stored at the Tooele Army Depot is almost twice as deadly as previously believed....

"The Army had estimated that breathing 70 milligrams of Sarin per minute in a cubic meter of air would cause serious health problems. The new studies showed that 40 milligrams in a minute was enough to kill anyone, and the estimate could be lowered to 35 milligrams per minute."

End of quote.

Here's another story that took place in 1968 about an accidental nerve gas release in Utah, which killed a whole bunch of sheep. There was an attempt by the US Government to hush this up, but word got out and it created quite a scandal. This came to be known as the Dugway Sheep Incident (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dugway_sheep_incident). It appears that the cause of these sheep deaths was that the Army was spraying some VX nerve gas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VX_%28nerve_agent%29) from a jet airplane (sort of like a super fast crop-duster) - some TWENTY SEVEN MILES away from the place where the thousands of sheep were instantly killed!!! The cloud of gas descended on the location - known as Skull Valley (appropriately), and instantaneously killed thousands of sheep. Fortunately no humans were around, or they'd have been killed, too.

Here's a newspaper article (http://lists.jammed.com/IWAR/1998/01/0004.html) that talks about this incident in detail.

From these articles, I would say that it would be quite easily conceivable to imagine that a release of nerve gas on the Island would have the potential to kill every living person on the Island.Aerial release upwind from a valley. Unless the freighter people lend Ben their helicopter I don't think he would be able to fly upwind from the island plus the island lacks the bowl shape of a valley to concentrate or hold the gas. A release from a higher elevation would drift down hill on a still day or spread a cone of death down wind if the wind were blowing. Either way (still air or breeze) I don't think the gas would be likely to blanket the entire island. A large release of gas might kill everyone but it seems unlikely without the use of either a massive vent system covering a couple hundred square miles or cannisters to allow selective release.

After all my denial of the possiblity of a gas release killing everyone if released in air at the station, I have to admit that there are cases of massive releases of volcanic gas killing every thing for miles around the vent. :eek2: Hopefully there is not that much gas available at the station.

How about using a volcano to spread gases?

also, referring to the gas canisters
Lost: The Complete Third Season (DVD) (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Lost:_The_Complete_Third_Season_%28DVD%29) commentary reveals that the mechanism for the purge at the Barracks was different from the mechanism Ben uses in the van (the canister of gas). The gas canister was added in post-production to give Ben a more active role in his father's death. But the original plan was for something to happen more or less island wide at 4 PM.Ref:http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Purge

A large release of gas might kill everyone but it seems unlikely without the use of either a massive vent system covering a couple hundred square miles or cannisters to allow selective release.

The "massive" vent system would not need to be that massive. It would only require the use of a network of small reinforced hoses that would transport the chemical over the Island to a series of strategically-placed aerosol nozzles where it would be nebulized as a mist into the air. This would be a fairly relatively easy and cheap delivery system - much cheaper and easier to put together than the sonic fence, the handy anti-Smokey tree boxes, and other things we've seen on the Island. It would be quite an effective way to kill everyone and everything on the Island within minutes, and I'm sure that this is what we'll find out TPTB have in mind in future episodes.

The "massive" vent system would not need to be that massive. It would only require the use of a network of small reinforced hoses that would transport the chemical over the Island to a series of strategically-placed aerosol nozzles where it would be nebulized as a mist into the air. This would be a fairly relatively easy and cheap delivery system - much cheaper and easier to put together than the sonic fence, the handy anti-Smokey tree boxes, and other things we've seen on the Island. It would be quite an effective way to kill everyone and everything on the Island within minutes, and I'm sure that this is what we'll find out TPTB have in mind in future episodes.OK we must define massive differently.:biggrin: Given the apparent size of the island and the need for coverage under various wind and weather conditions, I would suspect the distribution system, if it exists, would have cost more than the sonic barrier. If the agent is piped out in gaseous form it would need fair size ducts and some sort of fan sytem. Similar to installing furnace ducting for an island wide system, If it was piped out in liquid form it would again need pumping stations and a lengthy pipe system. Possibly a carrier agent such as water could carry the disolved agent allowing them to use equipment developed for irrigation use. Without a carrier agent you would need a humongus supply of the agent just to fill the pipe system. They need to enlarge the Tempest station to make me believe they have an adequate amount.

commentary reveals that the mechanism for the purge at the Barracks was different from the mechanism Ben uses in the van (the canister of gas). The gas canister was added in post-production to give Ben a more active role in his father's death.Without this ad hoc commentary I would have pointed out that with an island wide system Ben would not have needed a cannister - his dad would have been a goner anywhere on the island ditto the pigs and polar bears.

Oh well I guess this is no more unlikely than time travel and slow time barriers ;)

Oh well I guess this is no more unlikely than time travel and slow time barriers ;)

Heh. And there ya have it. ;) 'ing right back atcha! LOL!!!
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How about using a volcano to spread gases?

Hey, didn't the same thing happen on an episode of Gilligan's Island once? :redface:

It would only make sense to me that they used canisters in the purge as well. There is one thing in my opinion, that does not support that idea though. When Richard and Ben are back in the middle of the barracks with the bodies strewn about, Richard clearly checks his watch and then very slowly removes his gas mask. I always found him checking his watch to be very odd. It was is if there was a specific time frame in which the gas was effective or something. I dunno, could be nothing, but I found that strange.

I thought Richard was checking to see if enough time had passed for a gas released outside to disperse.

Heh. And there ya have it. ;) 'ing right back atcha! LOL!!!
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Hey, didn't the same thing happen on an episode of Gilligan's Island once? :redface:
LOL the actress who played Mary Ann was on the news tonight, busted for pot possesion.
Perhaps some of the ideas presented on the show did devolve evolve from Gilligan's Island? ;) ;) We have a professor in Daniel & a millonaire in Hurley Tom was captain of the small boat that stopped the raft we did have an actress for a while but she was burried alive. Is Kate our Mary Ann?

The more I look at the set up I arrive at the impression the distribution system would have to involve cannisters.

Is Kate our Mary Ann?
I think that Mary Ann would have to be Claire...:lipsseal:

This came to be known as the Dugway Sheep Incident (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dugway_sheep_incident). It appears that the cause of these sheep deaths was that the Army was spraying some VX nerve gas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VX_%28nerve_agent%29) from a jet airplane (sort of like a super fast crop-duster) - some TWENTY SEVEN MILES away from the place where the thousands of sheep were instantly killed!!! The cloud of gas descended on the location - known as Skull Valley (appropriately), and instantaneously killed thousands of sheep. Fortunately no humans were around, or they'd have been killed, too.

this lends support to the idea that the 'purge' gas was released by air. I pointed out the Island is approx. 20 miles long x 10 wide, so it would be 'doable', with a rocket filled with gas, or how about a high level airplane, like the kind that has been suppling all the Dharma food for years. (it was discussed that a chopper would have been heard making drops, so must be a plane, but is another topic.)

Now it's sounding like the scene in "Goldfinger" when P*ssy Galore and her girls air-spray the Army around Fort Knox???

Hey, didn't the same thing happen on an episode of Gilligan's Island once?

Common guys. Oooh, I got it! The gas was spread by the Harlem Globetrotters using gas filled basketballs......gives the term "Slam Dunk" a whole new deadly meaning.;)

If you aerosolized enough of it, you could do it.

For most of those nasty type of nerve gases, you don't need all that much to kill someone.

What if the gas is Smokey?? That would explain things but i don't know if i like this theory......:undecide:
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Ah ha! Darkufo has a screencap of the computer monitor Daniel is using to stop he gas, see where it says 'set vent c= open'
http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/

I think this answers the question of 'canisters v vents' problem!!!! Vents it is.....

Didn't Goodwin also mention at the beach with Juliette that he had the power to kill everyone on the island "by himself". Sorry if I am misquoting...but I thought it was something to that effect.

If it were canisters, how could Goodwin kill everyone on the island by himself? Maybe the Tempest doesn't have the capability of killing everyone on the island (or everything) , but only the people living in homes at Otherton.

But wait a minute, Charlotte told Jack that Farraday "just saved your life." That means that it can reach the beach, right? OK, I'm confused.

Also, how do the chemical burns on Goodwin's arm fit in with the nerve gas? Same substance or different?

Oh, and another thing, why use gas in the purge. Why not just shoot them? wouldn't that be easier? I mean if I have a gun and you have a canister, don't I win? Didn't Dharma have guns?

Also, how do the chemical burns on Goodwin's arm fit in with the nerve gas? Same substance or different?


The nerve agent that was being produced at the Tempest, VX, is not known to be especially caustic. Even if it was, VX is particularily toxic through dermal (skin) exposure, so a chemical burn would be the least of Goodwin's problems. Most likely, Goodwin was burned by exposure to a chemical used to synthesize VX.